Rav4 EV Not Charging Again

[Olaf1974]

Team,

I've been a long time 2nd owner of my Rav4 EV. It's been my main vehicle since May of 2017. I live in WI, so it's seen some winters as well. But, as many others have experienced, it can have some complicated issues. And once again mine is not charging. Looking to get some feedback based on the below information.

Quick History: 111K miles
2017 - Purchased end of April
2018 - Contactor repair under Platinum Warranty
2022 - Fuse Replacement (Local at EV Powers)
2023 - OBC Replacement (QC charge in CA)
2023 - Motor rebuild (QC charge in CA) [at the same time as OBC]
Honestly, the only other maintenance since I owned it has been 1 set of tires.

July 2024 I had the "Check EV System" warning for about 3 weeks prior. Vehicle ran fine, just the warning. I was planning on changing the 12V to the 70Ah AGM, thinking maybe the 50Ah inside was issued. But, as the 12V sat on my garage floor for a few days, the vehicle stopped charging. I replace the battery anyway, but still issued.

---------------------------

I did the quick Ohmmeter test on the J1227 port and got the following this post. Seems the fuses should be OK.

• Either AC input to chassis ground = 2.69M Ω & 2.69M Ω
• AC-to-AC input = 241k Ω

--------------------------

Thanks to Asavage who was able to provide a TPD port to Ethernet cable found in this post. It arrived today. Using the Tesla Powertrain Diagnostics ("TPD") v1.1.46 found in this post, I was able to get the Tesla side codes.

There are no diagnostic codes when running.

When charging I get the following code, which looks like some issue with the OBC. Please review and let me know if I can provide any additional diagnostic information. I'd be interested to hear what you think is the diagnosis and likely solution.

I was hoping it was not the OBC again....as I had to make the choice to replace OBC once already just last year. I know I cannot change the root cause, just correct it.




Battery Tab snapshot on charger attempt - ON[not READY state]


Battery Tab snapshot on charger attempt - OFF


Battery Tab on charger attempt



Thanks,
Olaf1974

 

[alflash]

With a high degree of probability (up to 95%), we can assume a faulty fuse in the Charger.
https://alflash.com.ua/2019/to_rav4ev/078a.png

There are dozens of descriptions of such repairs in this forum.
For example,
https://diag.alflash.com.ua/wp-content/uploads/2024/05/story2022-08-13.pdf
https://www.myrav4ev.com/threads/troubleshooting-charger-in-portland-or.2583/
https://www.myrav4ev.com/threads/20...-will-be-13k-vehicle-will-be-total-loss.2567/
https://www.myrav4ev.com/threads/pictures-from-my-onboard-charger-fuse-replacement.2463/#post-31422
https://www.myrav4ev.com/conversations/support-with-my-rav4-charger-repair.13446/#convMessage-20784
HTH,

 

[asavage]

I did the quick Ohmmeter test on the J1227 port and got the following this post. Seems the fuses should be OK.

• Either AC input to chassis ground = 2.69M Ω & 2.69M Ω
• AC-to-AC input = 241k Ω

Those measurements indicate the OBC's AC input fuses are intact. I have to assume some other OBC failure has occurred.

 

[hokiematt]

I concur with Al's assessment. Does QC Charge offer any warranty on their work, since you mention the OBC was changed last year?

I'm curious: are you using different software to produce your 'battery tab' info? Are you telnetting into the gateway perhaps?

 

[asavage]

Olaf mentions "Battery tab", which is Scan My Tesla nomenclature for the Android version. The iOS version of SMT that I use doesn't have tabs, but they're mentioned in SMT's docs.

 

[Olaf1974]

Gentlemen, Super thank you for your time and advice.

Seems the solution is to replace the OBC again. The QC charge warranty is 3 months or 3,000 miles. It's not a lot, but I don't think that's uncommon for auto repair. We all support driving an uncommon vehicle with greater than normal challenges for service. I did reach out to Tony at QC charge a few weeks ago and asked his opinion, which was as expected, fused or OBC. I'm unsure of the origin of the replacement OBC, but likely it's 2nd hand as the part's cost was $500. No reference to the OBC part origin can be found on the estimate. Toyota service part G9090-0R011 cost $3500 on line.

As the vehicle otherwise seems in good shape, I guess the lowest cost solution is to repair. I just have to deiced if I want to do this myself or pay someone. I suspect if I go back to Toyota it will be over $5,000 by now. I'm not super keen on working on HV battery vehicles myself. Even though I know you pull the safety disconnect under the passenger seat, it sill gives me some anxiety. It's just hard to stomach putting thousands of dollars more into this vehicle again after spending $9,000 a year ago with no guarantees. Seems this issue is endemic for Tesla Gen 1 OBC. I had overly optimistic thinking. I figured since the contactors, motor and OBC had now been repaired, I had the biggest issues behind me and would get a few more years of service at least.

I have not had time to read through the suggested OBC repair threads, so I'll just ask outright. I was told at one point that the vehicle would need to be reprogrammed to accept a different OBC from the original. Is this true? Could the program have defaulted to my original OBC causing error? Is it complicated to check or reprogram?

As for the "battery tab". I just mean the page in the TPD software related to that battery information. I'm just connected to my PC with the LAN port.

 

[asavage]

AFAIK, there are a few ways to replace a RAV4 EV OBC:

1. Buy a new one from Toyota, use TPD to mate it to the car.
2. Obtain a used RAV4 EV OBC, preferably with the OEM Ferraz Shawmut (Mersen) A50P50-4 fuses replaced with Eaton Bussmann (Cooper) FWH-50B units.
3. Obtain a Model S GEN1 OBC (eBay has lots, some for less than $200), then:
   1. Use TPD and attempt to flash it to work with the RAV4 EV. Vlad has had at least one that refused to obey, due to the firmware on the used MS OBC being too new
   2. Harvest one PCB from the malfunctioning OBC and transplant it to the MS OBC. This has been reported to work at least twice.

I have a Model S OBC, obtained from eBay two years ago, on my shelf. I bought it to see inside, but it could be pressed into use should I need to replace one on my car.

The dealer R&R labor for the OBC is reported to be 4.8 hours. Including replacing the fuses (and I did it the "hard" way, and did not cut the insulating fish paper, rather I performed add'l disassembly), I took around 12 hours in my driveway, over two days (replacement fuses and G48 were obtained in advance). It's not a lot of fun but doesn't require groveling underneath, either. The HVJB that is bolted to the OBC on the passenger side, that's mirror-on-a-stick work but with patience it can be done without having advanced knowledge. An EV specialist would be best for this kind of work, if you don't want to DIY, but anybody with motivation and a few tools can do it, IMO. Patience and not breaking anything are the important pieces.

 

[Olaf1974]

OK. I understand your point now on flashing firmware. Can that be done with the TPD v1.1.46 or do you need the V1.1.42?

Another thought. In your opinion, do you think the new Toyota service OBC parts are less likely to fail than the 2nd hand Ebay versions?

Is charging at 40A risky for the OBC? My Juicebox was stuck at 40A. The company changed something in 2020 and I lost access to adjust the charger power. I was able to get support last month and get the connection repaired.

Seems the Tesla OBC gen 1 has a high defect rate over gen 2. Would the OBC gen 2 work on Rav4 EV? Based on others experience, seems this would be very experimental. Saw on the Wiki that they used both the Gen1 & Gen 2 on Model S at the same time.

 

[davewill]

Any OBC you'd get from Toyota as this point is going to be reconditioned. It's anyone's guess whether a reconditioned unit would be any more reliable than a used one you'd get from another source.

I suppose you'd get a 1 year warranty on the OEM part vs. the more common 0-90 day warranty on a used one. But if Toyota doesn't do the labor, all that would get you is the part replaced.

 

[asavage]

Vlad surmises that 40A charging may cause more frequent failures of the OBC. IDK. There are many people charging at home @ 32A, and many @ 40. He's seen more of these than I have.

JuiceBox was bought out by Enel-X and subsequently screwed their installed base (eloquently covered by Transport Evolved), and I'm heartened that you were able to achieve some satisfaction with them.

Yes, the GEN2 OBC is a lot more reliable than the GEN1, as well as being smaller & lighter. AFAIK, nobody has a recipe for replacing the GEN1 OBC with a GEN2. I doubt it would be worth the effort (IMO).

I wrote that Wiki; there have been no other contributors, and I only documented what I could find in my own OBC and the postings of others, and there was some overlap on the Model S as to when some cars got the GEN2, and when some got GEN1 (as cited), but the GEN1 OBC wasn't in production for the MS very long; I think more were in use in SuperChargers than cars, if I had to guess.

 

[Arlin]

Vlad surmises that 40A charging may cause more frequent failures of the OBC. IDK. There are many people charging at home @ 32A, and many @ 40. He's seen more of these than I have.

JuiceBox was bought out by Enel-X and subsequently screwed their installed base (eloquently covered by Transport Evolved), and I'm heartened that you were able to achieve some satisfaction with them.

Yes, the GEN2 OBC is a lot more reliable than the GEN1, as well as being smaller & lighter. AFAIK, nobody has a recipe for replacing the GEN1 OBC with a GEN2. I doubt it would be worth the effort (IMO).

I wrote that Wiki; there have been no other contributors, and I only documented what I could find in my own OBC and the postings of others, and there was some overlap on the Model S as to when some cars got the GEN2, and when some got GEN1 (as cited), but the GEN1 OBC wasn't in production for the MS very long; I think more were in use in SuperChargers than cars, if I had to guess.

There is likely some truth to this. I have an EVSE that lets me crank it past 40 amps. I put it to 41 to get the full 39.9amps... And I only did this in the last 3 weeks when it was critical. I charged at that current about 3 times... So I can see how that might have added some heat and stress to the fuses. And they are fast blow fuses. Rated for 50 amps. Which might spike when you unplug it even if only for .001 sec or something. The other think is I also pushed the button and pulled the cord out all in 1 motion a lot and I bet it needs a delay like push the release then wait just 1 sec before pulling on the cord.

 

[Olaf1974]

It's been 6 weeks since I last posted. Just a quick update. Nothing has changed except I have been rejected or ghosted at every turn to get this thing serviced. EV repair shops in Madison and Chicago do not seem to want to accept the job. Starting to think I may have to do this myself. My wife and family really don't want me to do the work myself. They are worried might make a mistake or hurt myself. Does anyone know someone in the upper mid-west you think might do this work?

I did call one of those cash for cars dealers and they said they would give me $3K+ for it even if it's not charging. However, if it's working it's worth maybe $9K.....but I'd rather just keep it in that case. If I can't get it going, maybe get low cost used EV or PHEV with the Clean Vehicle Tax Credit.

Maybe there are other options. I'm open to suggestions.

 

[asavage]

Since we last spoke, it's been surmised that the resistance check I wrote about, at the inlet port, is not a reliable indicator of an OBC AC input fuse having failed. Still, it's more than likely that you have an OBC problem. You've really been a victim on the OBC front in your car, I don't recall anybody having had to service it more than twice.

It's a shame nobody in your area wants to tackle replacing the OBC.

 

[Olaf1974]

Appreciate the sentiment. If I find someone to help I'll let the group know.

Thanks for the update on the fuse test. Do you have a link to the discussion explaining why it is not reliable indicator?

 

[asavage]

Rakesh had "good" resistance measurements at the charge inlet:
https://www.myrav4ev.com/threads/charging-stopped-due-to-system-malfunction.2692/post-31688

and then found a failed fuse in his OBC:
https://www.myrav4ev.com/threads/charging-stopped-due-to-system-malfunction.2692/post-31859

The second egg-on-my-face moment (WRT my advice to Rakesh) started a bit later in the same thread:
https://www.myrav4ev.com/threads/charging-stopped-due-to-system-malfunction.2692/post-31864

I'll try to pull that board from my spare OBC, but it's kind of fussy if you don't cut the insulating paper, and I'm also pretty busy with other things . . . and I'm reasonably certain that Vlad is correct, from my diagramming of the AC Input PCB from when I populated the Wiki with info on this OBC. And, I trust that Rakesh really did have "good" resistance readings at the charge inlet before removing his OBC.

 

[bdunst]

Al, I am a bit confused about Gen 1 vs Gen 2 Tesla OBC. I would like to pick one up on ebay to dissect as well Can you tell me which tesla part number is the one that works in our Ravs? Thanks

 

[asavage]

What I've written in the past:

https://openinverter.org/wiki/Tesla_Model_S_GEN1_Charger

"The Tesla GEN1 on-board AC charger (OBC) was a single phase 10kW AC charger that was fitted originally and primarily in the Tesla Model S, from Jun2012 through late2013*, when it was replaced with GEN2. GEN1 models are easy to identify, having the word "TESLA" stamped on the top metalwork and having no black anti-tamper tape; the GEN2 charger lacks the Tesla identifier stamped on the metalwork, and has anti-tamper tape over the seams."

• Dimensions: 19-13/16" L x 13-7/16" W x 4-7/16" H (503mm L x 341mm W x 113mm H)
• Weight: 42 lbs (19 kg)

Tesla Part Numbers (TPN):

• 6009278-00-x
• 6009278-84-x (ReManufactured + Slave?)
• 6009354-00-x

Lots & lots are available via eBay, starting at around USD$200.


Toyota Part Numbers:

• G9090-0R010 (discontinued)
• G9090-0R011

---

https://openinverter.org/wiki/Tesla_Model_S/X_GEN2_Charger

"The Tesla GEN2 on-board charger (OBC) is a single/three phase 10kW AC charger that was fitted in the Model S from approx. Oct2013[1] until it was replaced in the 2016 'facelift' model with GEN3. It was the first Tesla OBC capable of fully utilizing external 3-phase AC; previous Tesla OBCs lacked the external wiring for three phases."

 

[asavage]

You might look at Fred's, $150 + shipping.

 

[bdunst]

Awesome! Thanks Al.

 

[fred_dot_u]

Yeah, thanks, Al. If we survive the storm heading our way, I might have a sale! I'm getting too old for this stuff. Not the cars, the hurricanes!