My Complaint Rant

[TonyWilliams]

I'm getting tired of constantly driving it to the dealership for 5000 mile checkups, plus the MULTITUDE of failures that I've had on the car. The ongoing and seemingly never to be fixed charge timer issue. The replacement (Tesla) motor that is now starting to make noise just like the last one. Heck, I only bought the car because of the Tesla drivetrain and big battery pack with TMS. Virtually EVERY Tesla supplied piece of hardware has been unbolted from my car so far. The heater failed. The charge port melted (I blame Blink/REMA for that one, though). The car currently has a "Check EV System" failure and has been in the shop all week, and probably next week, too.

The ride quality is not so smooth and the interior sucks for a $50k car. It's a phased out body style, and Toyota openly doesn't support EVs. No spare tire is just DUMB, too, but that seems to be the EV norm. 120 volt / 12 amp EVSE? Three miles per HOUR???? The same EVSE that Toyota uses in their 11 mile range Plug-In Prius (while Tesla supplies full 40 amp EVSE in their cars). Are you kidding me when there is onboard capabilty of a 40 amp / 277 volt charger? Yippee!! No DC quick charge option, even though Toyota is an official CHAdeMO member company.

Gas gauge that stops at 80% full??? What brain surgeon thought that made sense? A resistance heater in a $50k EV ???... even the LEAF at about 2/3 the price offers a heat pump. Poor implementation of charging station mapping (only works with internet connected smart phone with app running), plus it doesn't come close to what I can just find on PlugShare. No mention in the owner's manual about long term storage for the $36,000 retail price traction battery?

Plus, I always thought the Rav4's were girl cars.

 

[Blastphemy]

I can't wait for the Tesla Model X so that all these problems will be just a faded memory of a lesser vehicle...

 

[reeler]

I like that the RAV4 EV has a noisier motor. My Leaf is much quieter, but I like having the auditory feedback as I zip around. The Tesla Roadster was much louder and this level of feedback is just about right. I have listened to the recordings and it sounds about like mine and I LIKE IT. One mans feature is another's bug.

I know we paid $40K after incentives for our RAV4 EV, but the price is closer to $27K now. The similarly equipped RAV4 ICE is about the same price. We give up a little range, but save on fueling. The car is a super fast RAV4 that requires little or no maintenance.

If you are disappointed, I would say you have to lower your expectations. The heater is the only failure that I think you can blame on Toyota. I am out of state, so I will do my 5K mile brake/tire inspections myself. The EVSE is for emergency use and not daily. I have never used CHAdeMO on my Leaf and only charged twice away from home/office in over two years (equivalent) of driving electric. The original Leaf had the same resistance heater and had to change it because of their unacceptably small battery which isn't an issue with the RAV4. My cars for the last 10 years skipped the spare tire (Sienna AWD, Leaf, Think, BMW) and I haven't changed one in that same time period on the road. I only charge to 80%, which I think is what they intend you to do, so don't see that issue.

I disagree, respectfully.

 

[TonyWilliams]

I disagree, respectfully.

Uh, what are you disagreeing with? Most of what I posted are facts. It comes with a 3 mile per hour charge cable. Fact.

My motor / gearbox assembly was replaced. Fact.

The "girl car" comment, of course, opinion.

 

[reeler]

Uh, what are you disagreeing with? Most of what I posted are facts. It comes with a 3 mile per hour charge cable. Fact.

I have no disagreement with the facts. I just don't care about the issues you raise and gave my contrary thoughts on each. The RAV4 is far more car than my Leaf or Think and it exceeds all my expectations.

 

[TonyWilliams]

Uh, what are you disagreeing with? Most of what I posted are facts. It comes with a 3 mile per hour charge cable. Fact.

I have no disagreement with the facts. I just don't care about the issues you raise and gave my contrary thoughts on each. The RAV4 is far more car than my Leaf or Think and it exceeds all my expectations.

Well, sure, I really like the car, but then it wouldn't be a proper rant, right? Heck, it kills the LEAF and a Think... eek!!

I mostly disappointed that in 6 months, it has spent about 1 month in a shop. That's a fact, too.

 

[AvLegends]

I mostly disappointed that in 6 months, it has spent about 1 month in a shop. That's a fact, too.

I think that qualifies for the lemon law... not sure if it's 30 days total for repairs or if they have to be the same repair issue.

 

[Dsinned]

The RAV4 EV definitely has "issues", but I find it "overall" to be a car that meets my expectations. It could be better, of course, ALL other model cars as well.

The one and only worse thing about it to me is the faulty charging scheduler, but even that is only a minor issue really. However, the clock is still ticking on that one - six months and counting - almost to the point of absurdity!

The only other REAL issue is that Toyota only sells this car to meet CARB ZEV mandates, and Toyota's attitude and that of essentially all their "authorized" CA dealers is generally lacking when it comes to promoting good customer relations. The only back handed saving grace for this vehicle, ironically, has been such poor sales, which has benefitted many here financially since the first of the year. However, It's hard to be forgiving of this car's faults, even if only minor, when some members here paid so dearly to become the first owners. For that matter, even the lesser model SUVs in Toyota's lineup come with a full complement of cup holder liners ($49 each OTC parts), but not so in any of ours. :shock:

 

[occ]

Plus, I always thought the Rav4's were girl cars.

If the rav4 is a girls car, and the tesla s is the rich mans car, what other choice do you have out there? The testosterone LEAF, fit, or focus?

I love the rav4ev. My only beef with it is the cabin noise. I had too high expectation that all ev should be like that of the leaf, noiseless, quite, and serene, as that was one big selling point from EVgelicals.

 

[TonyWilliams]

My only beef with it is the cabin noise. I had too high expectation that all ev should be like that of the leaf, noiseless, quite, and serene, as that was one big selling point from EVgelicals.

Another issue... all season tires off the V6 limited Rav4. Noisy and not particularly efficient.

Yes, the LEAF is a high standard. It's far too short on range for me and the battery degradation is absurd compared to its competition.

 

[doug401]

Yes... with all the short comings, there is still one huge overriding factor,
http://www.pbase.com/doug401/image/150386709

Don't loose site of the goal

 

[srl99]

I'm getting tired of constantly driving it to the dealership for 5000 mile checkups, plus the MULTITUDE of failures that I've had on the car. The ongoing and seemingly never to be fixed charge timer issue. The replacement (Tesla) motor that is now starting to make noise just like the last one. Heck, I only bought the car because of the Tesla drivetrain and big battery pack with TMS. Virtually EVERY Tesla supplied piece of hardware has been unbolted from my car so far. The heater failed. The charge port melted (I blame Blink/REMA for that one, though). The car currently has a "Check EV System" failure and has been in the shop all week, and probably next week, too.

The ride quality is not so smooth and the interior sucks for a $50k car. It's a phased out body style, and Toyota openly doesn't support EVs. No spare tire is just DUMB, too, but that seems to be the EV norm. 120 volt / 12 amp EVSE? Three miles per HOUR???? The same EVSE that Toyota uses in their 11 mile range Plug-In Prius (while Tesla supplies full 40 amp EVSE in their cars). Are you kidding me when there is onboard capabilty of a 40 amp / 277 volt charger? Yippee!! No DC quick charge option, even though Toyota is an official CHAdeMO member company.

Gas gauge that stops at 80% full??? What brain surgeon thought that made sense? A resistance heater in a $50k EV ???... even the LEAF at about 2/3 the price offers a heat pump. Poor implementation of charging station mapping (only works with internet connected smart phone with app running), plus it doesn't come close to what I can just find on PlugShare. No mention in the owner's manual about long term storage for the $36,000 retail price traction battery?

Plus, I always thought the Rav4's were girl cars.

How heavy is that trailer you're towing, again?

 

[waidy]

Tony, thanks for creating this thread. I agree totally that it is unreasonable of the 12 Amp mobile EVSE. I do not agree that the Rav4 is a girl's car, but it is just my opinion. No QC/DC capability is also a disappointment (though my 2011 LEAF's QC port was a virgin after owning it for almost 2 years). Here's mine:
1. No Heated windshield;
2. HVAC is not Heat Pump;
3. Not enough re-gen handles;
4. Schedule time charge bug;
5. No start time charging capability and % of charge setting;
6. Cell balancing is not done *right after* charge completion;
7. No gauge reading for 100% SOC and usage;
8. No online charging report for xls export;
9. No rain sensor;

I can live with #4, #5 (I am a net energy producer I never use time charging). Items 1, 2, 3 affects efficiency which i care a lot. #6-9 is purely annoying items.

I still like my RAVs for these 3 reasons: It has the biggest battery pack after Model S; fastest on board L2 charger in compare to all other EVs except for the Model S; It has a liquid cool TMS.

 

[TonyWilliams]

How heavy is that trailer you're towing, again?

About 1200 pounds, why?

 

[TonyWilliams]

Yes... with all the short comings, there is still one huge overriding factor,
http://www.pbase.com/doug401/image/150386709

Don't loose site of the goal

I can forget oil in a Nissan LEAF (that I never had any problems with, 35,000 miles driven, except the battery degrades more than other cars) or a Tesla Model S.

 

[snoltor]

I was surprised by the no spare tire norm when I first started researching EVs. I see quite a few DIYers on this forum, has anyone considered getting ahold of a rear door from a 2012 gasser and swapping that in? Yes it'd be more weight, not to mention long odds to find one in good shape, in your color, in a scrap yard but the thought crosses my mind each time I see that spare tire on a 2012 gasser. Perhaps I've got bad luck but I've had 3 flats in the past 3 years. Was lucky enough that 2 must have occurred on my way evening commute home from work because I noticed them in the morning just as I was about to leave for work the next day, and the third was a slow leak so I was able to get to a tire place. You'd think I live next to a nail factory....

No spare tire is just DUMB, too, but that seems to be the EV norm.

 

[waidy]

I was surprised by the no spare tire norm when I first started researching EVs. I see quite a few DIYers on this forum, has anyone considered getting ahold of a rear door from a 2012 gasser and swapping that in? Yes it'd be more weight, not to mention long odds to find one in good shape, in your color, in a scrap yard but the thought crosses my mind each time I see that spare tire on a 2012 gasser. Perhaps I've got bad luck but I've had 3 flats in the past 3 years. Was lucky enough that 2 must have occurred on my way evening commute home from work because I noticed them in the morning just as I was about to leave for work the next day, and the third was a slow leak so I was able to get to a tire place. You'd think I live next to a nail factory....

My 2002 Rav4EV came with a spare tire mounted at the rear under the cargo area. 10 years of driving, I have never used it. Not that I didn't have flat. It is because AAA truck came faster than replacing the spare the flat myself.

 

[snoltor]

I'm hoping that SOS button really works!

It is because AAA truck came faster than replacing the spare the flat myself.

 

[TonyWilliams]

I've already had one flat on the Rav4. It destroyed the tire, and I had to buy a new one. Fortunately, the spare tire/wheel that I got for the LEAF worked perfectly until my new tire arrived from Tire Rack.

I had three or four flats on both LEAFs, also normally without a spare tire. Even our Infiniti G37 convertible does not have a spare.

 

[waidy]

Perhaps the 2013 model has couple of extra items that the 2012 doesn't have, OR at least they were not in my 2012 Ravs. According to http://www.toyota.com/content/ebrochure/2013/rav4ev_ebrochure.pdf‎ Page 3 last line: "Tire repair system included". Then on Page 4 under Charging time, it has "16Amp 240" (not sure whether it implies 2013 mobile EVSE has 16Amp Capability). Would 2012 Rav4EVians please comment?