California Electric Vehicle Submetering Pilot Program

[emotorwerks]

So, you're going to contact me with more details?

Also, which outlet should I have installed.

Yes, but I need to get a few things lined up before we converse. In terms of the outlet, it's this one, as someone already indicated above. It's also specifically called out in the program FAQ. As already mentioned, please feel free to contact us at [email protected].

 

[emotorwerks]

Please elaborate on what specific rollout issue(s) did the CPUC impose on MDMAs, and what is the solution? Apparently it is some sort of companion device to be co-located with the sub-metering JB itself. But, what is it, what does it do, and how does it work?

Dennis, we are working on incorporating a fully certified and UL-listed smart meter into the trial package. Given the economics of this program, and both the availability and the cost of UL-listed smart meters, this was not a trivial problem to solve. We are working with couple of metering companies, and hope to change this approach in the future. Just as a point of reference, the pilot Itron collaborated on with ClipperCreek has reportedly taken three years to implement. While it was perhaps a bit naive to assume that it will be much easier in our case, we are still optimistic about it. Please let us know if you had any constraints you had to work with, which make it more difficult to wait.

CLIPPERCREEK LAUNCHES ITRON ENABLED SMART METERING CHARGING STATION

 

[srl99]

iTron makes some utility grade sub meters, as well as load control devices (and some combinations). What are you planning to install next to the JB? If you are installing this second box, maybe you can just go back to regular JB's. BTW - iTron makes a box which controls and meters water heaters - it would be great if it had >30A rating (actually, how the heck does it work with an electric water heater if it's rated at 30A?!?).

 

[emotorwerks]

iTron makes some utility grade sub meters, as well as load control devices (and some combinations). What are you planning to install next to the JB? If you are installing this second box, maybe you can just go back to regular JB's. BTW - iTron makes a box which controls and meters water heaters - it would be great if it had >30A rating (actually, how the heck does it work with an electric water heater if it's rated at 30A?!?).

Yes, absolutely. Without wanting to give away everything, let's just say that this is the direction Electric Motor Werks took as well. I particularly approve of your idea of integrating meters and charging stations. The results achievable by combining both devices, and the potential for cost reduction are very attractive.

 

[Dsinned]

Please elaborate on what specific rollout issue(s) did the CPUC impose on MDMAs, and what is the solution? Apparently it is some sort of companion device to be co-located with the sub-metering JB itself. But, what is it, what does it do, and how does it work?

Dennis, we are working on incorporating a fully certified and UL-listed smart meter into the trial package. Given the economics of this program, and both the availability and the cost of UL-listed smart meters, this was not a trivial problem to solve. We are working with couple of metering companies, and hope to change this approach in the future. Just as a point of reference, the pilot Itron collaborated on with ClipperCreek has reportedly taken three years to implement. While it was perhaps a bit naive to assume that it will be much easier in our case, we are still optimistic about it. Please let us know if you had any constraints you had to work with, which make it more difficult to wait.

CLIPPERCREEK LAUNCHES ITRON ENABLED SMART METERING CHARGING STATION

I realize this adds another layer of complexity to the sub-metering JB's capabilities, so I can certainly wait. In fact, due to the approaching sunset date for PG&E's E-9A rate payers, which terminates at the end of March, I think a lot of us can wait till then, since that will automatically trigger a rate plan change anyway. I would be reluctant to voluntarily transfer out of E-9A before then.

HAPPY HOLIDAYS EVERYONE!!!

 

[drmanny3]

I am wondering about when I will have a chance to purchase the Juice box and participate in the program. I have not seen much information with respect to SCE. Any updates as to when units will be available and how SCE is working the program?
Thanks,
Manny

 

[emotorwerks]

I am wondering about when I will have a chance to purchase the Juice box and participate in the program. I have not seen much information with respect to SCE. Any updates as to when units will be available and how SCE is working the program?
Thanks,
Manny

Dr. Manny, we had good interactions with SCE (Al Shepetuk and others). As already mentioned upthread, we have unfortunately not been able to meet all the requirements, and have delayed shipments of PEV Pilot hardware as a result. We are working through these requirements, and should have more information for you in January. We had a meeting with the California Public Utilities Commission last week, where this situation and the timeline going forward was discussed in great detail. We are confident that the remedies we have recently identified will resolve the current impasse.

 

[srl99]

Anyone interested in obtaining one of the first PEV Pilot JB's? This one has only been used a couple of times, has the orange J cable (which I believe is rated 30A), has a range cord input (I believe 40A), and says 60A on the label.

It has the WiFi module which is known to have issues, but connected fine to my Apple Airport (using WPS), as I was willing to remove the lid and push the button inside while connected to 240VAC with potential exposed high voltage. [Note: do NOT use a metal fork, knife or pen to push this button!] It recorded the estimated power consumption up to the EMW website while charging my vehicles.

Bay Area, East Bay or Silicon Valley transfer preferred. I won't ship it, but I will bring it to a shipping center (Mail Boxes Etc.) for them to pack and ship if you pre-arrange.

I believe I can return it to EMW, but if you want it … let me know.

 

[Bassman]

The big issue with this program is if you have solar. They won't let you offset your EV charging use. You'll have to pay for the electrical consumption. that made it a big no for me.

 

[dstjohn99]

The big issue with this program is if you have solar. They won't let you offset your EV charging use. You'll have to pay for the electrical consumption. that made it a big no for me.

What utility are you with? The solar offset thing MAY be an issue, but IF that's true for your utility there is nothing that keeps you from plugging into the JB for the PEV trial once a month to participate and get the rebates, and use your other charger the rest of the time.

 

[Bassman]

I'm with PG&E . The rep from E Motorworks was at our Sac EV meeting last week and said that PG&E specifically exempted solar offseting of the EV charging under the submeter program. I'm currently on their EV-9B rate until they discontinue it, so I have a sepearate meter already.

 

[Ferdball]

PEV Pilot update from emotorwerks.

1) They have a buy back program if you need a charger while you wait.
2) There's still room in the program if you're an SDGE customer.

 

[Dsinned]

The "buyback" offering is by invitation only for people already on the PEV Sub-metering Pilot waiting list. There is a $10/week usage fee while using a non-pilot JB until returned.

Availability of CPUC approved submetering JBs will take a while longer - perhaps a few more months - to be completely ready for deployment.

KUDOS to eMW team for coming up with this interim program! :mrgreen:

 

[emotorwerks]

Glad you like the buy-back program, Dennis! Based on what we have seen from Ferdie and others, it was clear that there was a need for an interim solution. eMotorWerks is committed to help make the PEV Pilot a success, and we appreciate your interest and support.

 

[emotorwerks]

Happy spring! It’s been a few weeks since our last PEV Pilot program update.

The UL certification process for JuiceBox™ is still ongoing. We submitted three units to the UL lab in Illinois for high-risk tests. A fourth JuiceBox was submitted to the UL lab in San Jose. We won't have a predictable timeline until after we pass these tests, which should take just a couple of weeks. We are expecting UL certification by this summer.

However, if you can’t wait, there is a new way to get onto a submetered EV tariff right now. If you have a pre-existing NRTL-certified charging station, you can request a certified WiFi-enabled WattBox™ submeter from us. This submeter comes in a waterproof UL-listed enclosure, and it would be installed alongside your existing charging station. A WattBox will allow us to enroll you in the pilot, and get you onto the preferential time-of-use tariff.

There is no charge for WattBox. Moreover, we will contribute up to $100 towards the installation of a WattBox submeter under the terms of the PEV Pilot, which in our experience should in most cases fully offset your electrician’s bill. The installation process itself is very straightforward, and it will only take about half an hour or so.

Please feel free to peruse the WattBox FAQ for additional information. The signup form for the WattBox PEV Pilot offer is referenced below. As always, please don't hesitate to reach out to us through email ([email protected]) or through our Power Users group on Facebook.


http://emotorwerks.com/free-wattbox



Click to open

 

[drmanny3]

Good to hear that things are moving forward. I went ahead and signed up for the WattBox. I am currently using the Leviton 40 amp unit that is NRTL certified for the Rav4EV. How soon will I be able to acquire the WattBox? Will I still be able to acquire the JuiceBox unit once it is UL approved and take advantage of the rebate? Our other Electric car is charging using a JESLA unit which I assume is not NRTL certified. I would like to use the JuiceBox to replace the JESLA on a regular basis and use the JESLA as a back up.
Manny

 

[emotorwerks]

Good to hear that things are moving forward. I went ahead and signed up for the WattBox. I am currently using the Leviton 40 amp unit that is NRTL certified for the Rav4EV. How soon will I be able to acquire the WattBox? Will I still be able to acquire the JuiceBox unit once it is UL approved and take advantage of the rebate? Our other Electric car is charging using a JESLA unit which I assume is not NRTL certified. I would like to use the JuiceBox to replace the JESLA on a regular basis and use the JESLA as a back up.
Manny

Dr. Manny, thank you for signing up for the WattBox offer. We are presently shipping this submeter in volume and with immediate availability. I would expect your WattBox to arrive within a week. To be clear, you are still qualified to receive a free JuiceBox, which you have previously signed up for. If you want to take delivery of a WattBox now, and get a UL-certified JuiceBox later, the PEV Pilot will support staggered hardware delivery, and you will keep your place in line to receive a fully-rebated JuiceBox charging station - in addition to the WattBox.

The JESLA, as well as the Tesla Mobile Connector, are not NRTL-certified. Consequently, they are not qualified to participate in the PEV Pilot per utility requirements. The is exactly the same issue eMotorWerks has encountered with JuiceBox, and which is being remedied through the UL certification process. Unfortunately, this process has taken much longer than anticipated.

 

[drmanny3]

Great. I have ordered the WattBox. I am wondering if I should order a second or wait till the JuiceBox is UL approved and available? Will you continue to utilize the combination of WattBox and JuiceBox? Or will your UL approved JuiceBox have an internal capability (equivalent to internal WattBox)? I presently have the Leviton which I will use for the WattBox to charge the Rav4EV. Our other EV is a Kia Soul EV and I am presently using the JESLA to charge it. I would like to keep the WattBox on the Leviton and then acquire your UL JuiceBox and another WattBox if necessary. Can I run two systems? UL seems to have their own schedule.
Regards and thanks for a quick response,
Manny

 

[Dsinned]

In the past eMW has been criticized - I believe unfairly - for its lack of "customer" support. However, from all that I've seen in recent months, this small startup in the SF Bay Area has been EXTREMELY proactive and supportive of its customers, especially those of us lucky enough to live in CA. First, eMW offered a JB "buyback" program, and now the WattBox. I must admit waiting for the UL certified JB has been an ordeal for all concerned. Understandably, it has certainly been a very lengthy approval process through no fault of eMW.

I am so eager to begin the pilot submetering program with PG&E that earlier this week, I ordered an eMW WattBox. I expect delivery later today thanks to eMW's relatively quick delivery service. Thank you!

I also had a buyback JB for about a month up until recently to try out as well, although it was not the soon-to-be UL approved version. Therefore, I could not use it to participate in the PEV submetering pilot with my utility company.

Long story short, I was notified by PG&E that the special EV residential E-9 rates were to be discontinued at the end of March, so just this past week I arranged to transfer my existing account and primary meter to E-1. E1 is NOT a "TOU" rate plan, but has the lowest baseline per kWh cost (presumably $0.16/kWh). My only other choice would have been E-6 (btw, E-7 is no longer available), which is actually a TOU plan but has a much higher baseline rate than E-1. Since I am already have solar and am over generating more often than not, I decided to go for E-1. At the same time I am also now fully eligible to enroll in the PEV submetering pilot. In effect, by my next billing cycle, I should now have TWO rate plans with PG&E, i.e. E-1 for the primary meter, and EV-B using the WattBox as the so-called "secondary" meter. The only other thing needed is a third party, ETRL certified EVSE and I have two, i.e. the ones that came with each of my EVs. I still have my old JB as well. I use to have a Leviton L2 EVSE but sold it to a friend, but will swap my JB with his Leviton to use with the WattBox. This arrangement is only temporary until the UL approved JB finally comes to fruition. In the meantime, I will use the WattBox and a 3rd party EVSE to commence the PEV submetering pilot for all my EV charging needs.

Btw, the WattBox for use with the CPUC's submeter pilot, as provided by eMW (and OhmConnect), is at no cost other than a small S&H fee. THANKS again eMW!!!

 

[fromport]

Great. I have ordered the WattBox. I am wondering if I should order a second or wait till the JuiceBox is UL approved and available? Will you continue to utilize the combination of WattBox and JuiceBox? Or will your UL approved JuiceBox have an internal capability (equivalent to internal WattBox)? I presently have the Leviton which I will use for the WattBox to charge the Rav4EV. Our other EV is a Kia Soul EV and I am presently using the JESLA to charge it. I would like to keep the WattBox on the Leviton and then acquire your UL JuiceBox and another WattBox if necessary. Can I run two systems? UL seems to have their own schedule.
Regards and thanks for a quick response,
Manny

From the FAQ:

Is there a limit on how many WattBoxes I can buy?

The trial-specific WattBox order web page will permit the purchase of only one item at a time. Should you need to acquire a larger number of WiFi-enabled submeters or wish to place a volume order, please contact eMotorWerks directly at [email protected].


I am pretty sure it could measure 2 14-50 doing 80 amps easily. But it would need to go in 1 breaker.
Won't work when you use 2 breaker sets