Tesla model S with 200k miles: 6% battery loss

[fromport]

A (long distance taxi/car hire) company ran a 2015 model S 200K miles.
Key points:
6% battery degradation after 200K miles, charged to 100% every day.
No other major maintenance issues

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/tesloops-200k-miles-model-s.78157/

I think we have the right components in our rav4ev's ;-)

 

[smkettner]

From the article:

"Then, just as the car hit 200,000 miles, the range estimator became inaccurate. Though the car didn’t actually lose any range, the estimator would say it could go another ten miles—and then power down. Tesla looked into the issue, and told Tesloop that there’s a battery chemistry state that high-mileage cars go into, and the software isn’t properly compensating for that change. There will be a firmware update in three months that will take care of the discrepancy, but Tesla just replaced the battery to solve the problem. “We got our 6% range back with the new battery,” Sonnad said with a laugh. “But had the firmware been updated, we’d be fine and plugging along.”"

If RAV encounters this software issue do you expect the same support from Toyota on an out of warranty vehicle?

I will not have mine at 200k to find out. Tesla battery is amazing.

 

[fromport]

If RAV encounters this software issue do you expect the same support from Toyota on an out of warranty vehicle?
I will not have mine at 200k to find out. Tesla battery is amazing.

Nope.
Either Tesla made a super great support contract for themselves or the lawyers of Toyota were totally asleep when they signed the contracts.
It is obvious that Toyota doesn't want to spent a dime for this project anymore than necessary.
I intend to keep my rav4ev for a while, maybe I will run into after some more years.

 

[cwerdna]

No other major maintenance issues

Front DU was replaced per https://techcrunch.com/2016/09/29/tales-from-a-tesla-model-s-at-200k-miles/?ncid=mobilenavtrend

“We did have a few things go wrong,” Sonnad said. At about 30,000 miles, the car was relaying messages to Tesla HQ that the motor was operating at low power. “Tesla called us up and told us that,” Sonnad said. “We didn’t notice any problems. It was super fast.” But Tesla had the company bring the car in, and it replaced the front motor.

I would be curious to hear more details as to any other repairs done and on any other vehicles in their fleet.

 

[cashcow]

Didn't Tony Williams already drive one, or both, of his RAV4 EVs past the 200k miles mark? Unless I am wrong the MS has the active cooling system on all the time pampering the main battery pack while Toyota decided it was not needed with the RAV4 EV so I think it means out packs are less well taken care of.

Also, I wonder if Tony does all his maintenance himself? Including flushing the main pack's coolant?

 

[miimura]

When the RAV4 EV is Off, it's really Off. The Tesla cars are never really completely powered down. Therefore, the Tesla cars can do more when they are parked than the RAV4 EV can. When the cars are On and being driven, there's not that much difference in the battery and cooling systems. Tony probably has more than 200,000 miles driven on RAV4 EVs that he has owned, but not all on the same car. I think there are others on this forum that have higher odometer readings on their RAVs.

 

[TonyWilliams]

The BMS and telematics is operating all the time (24-7), which is why this car kills 12 volt batteries. When you replace the battery, please use an AGM, Group 24F, 60 Ah battery like the Bosch or Exide battery from Pep Boys, Amazon, etc. if you park the car for more than a week or so, put the 12 volt on a trickle charger / battery tender. If you're buying a trickle charger, make sure it has a setting for AGM batteries. I still recommend the Valence U1-12RT for a premium lithium 12 volt replacement.

I have about the following miles driven in a RAV4 EV:

RAV4 #1134 - 78,000 miles (about 15% battery degradation)

RAV4 #2496 - 23,000 miles (negligible battery degradation)

The third, RAV4 #3021 is driven by my brother, with 36,000 miles.

 

[cashcow]

15% battery degradation @ 78k doesn't seem very good. What do you think the cause could be? Is it just because the battery is smaller than the 2015 model S?

 

[TonyWilliams]

15% battery degradation @ 78k doesn't seem very good. What do you think the cause could be? Is it just because the battery is smaller than the 2015 model S?

We don't have the same cells (ours are the older / cheaper 2600ma cells), nor do we have aggressive heating and cooling of the cells; that's two differences.

Another difference is the "200,000 mile" Tesla that only has "6%" degradation also had the battery replaced. Finally, that battery was only about a year or so old.

It seems a little hard for me to believe that the cells ACTUAL degradation was only 6%. You'll hear Volt owners bragging about near zero degradation, but I can assure that there is. That degradation is merely masked by the software. For instance, when a Volt is new, the car charges from 20% to 80%, and as the battery degrades, the charge goes to 15% to 85% for 10% degradation, then 10% to 90% for 20% degradation, etc.

 

[TonyWilliams]

15% battery degradation @ 78k doesn't seem very good. What do you think the cause could be? Is it just because the battery is smaller than the 2015 model S?

 

[michael]

6% degradation at 200 K miles is not plausible. It's either not true, or the battery was replaced as suggested above.

15% at 78K is pretty good. Ours is down maybe 10%-15% at 60K miles, extended charge at least half the time.