Charging stopped by wall plug removal or blackout - HELP!

[Scott1258]

We've had the Rav for a week now and charging has been going well. However, last night plugged in and a few minutes later charging stops and we got a message in the car that states: Charging stopped by wall plug removal or blackout. We have the Leviton charger and the red fault light was on. The wall plug for the charger was all plugged in.

So, I reset everything, plugged the car back in and it starts to charge and seemed okay. This morning the car gave the same message and did not fully charge.

Hopefully someone could shed a little light on this for me. What is the car referring to by a blackout? Does that mean we stopped getting power to the house last night and the charger quite working? Nothing else in the house seemed to be affected - all the clocks are working, etc... The wall plug is plugged in so no one pulled this out.

Would appreciate any others who have info on this and what to do to correct it. Is the problem with the charger? The car? or is it a problem with the power coming into the house? I'm not sure what direction to take to make sure this doesn't happen again.

Thanks for the help!

Scott

 

[fooljoe]

I'd try charging with a different EVSE to make sure it's not the car causing the problem. You could try at your dealer, or find a place on plugshare, or even just use the included 120v EVSE. Assuming your car charges fine under those circumstances, then it's either your Leviton EVSE or your home's power. You'll probably want to engage Leviton support right away and see what they say, and if you can find another 40amp EVSE to try on the same circuit you should do that too.

If possible, use a voltage tester on the line to determine the voltage both before and during charging. If you're getting a pretty bad voltage drop, then that could be causing the problem, and you'll probably want to involve an electrician at that point.

 

[Scott1258]

Hey Joe,

Thanks for the information. I've contacted Leviton and have spoken to one of their reps this morning. I'm waiting for a call back to see what they are going to do. One of their first questions was if I used their installer service. I didn't. I used a local electrician to install. She told me if I had they would just send a truck out immediately and take care of whatever the problem was. Since I didn't, she told me if it's not the charger and they send a truck out they will charge me for the service call. For them it seems like the question becomes whether or not the electrical work was done properly. I used a licensed electrician with 25 years of experience. 50 amp breaker, 6 gauge wire, conduit and all.

She wanted to call and talk to whomever at Leviton to see what Leviton wanted to do with this since it was working fine for a week. Since it's the weekend I think she's just an independent contractor with them to field tech calls.

We'll see how this plays out with Leviton.

 

[Scott1258]

Here's a follow up: I received a call from the contractor for Leviton to come out this afternoon to troubleshoot and replace if necessary the Leviton charger. I was told the electrician who will be coming out will call me within a couple hours as he is in route and has to go to Corona to get his service truck and a new charger to bring with him. 5 min. later I get a call from Carrie, the tech person I initially talked with to make sure the contractor had called me. She told me she was not able to get a hold of whomever at Leviton to find out how they wanted to handle it, so she made the executive decision to just send someone out. Wow! I'm really impressed with this level of service on a Sunday morning!

I'll post up what happens and what the problem ends up being. Only down side is I'm stuck at home waiting for the electrician. Not a bad trade off.

 

[Dianne]

We had this problem with Leviton about a year and a half ago, coming at the WORST time because I had so many PHEVs to charge so quickly... and it took a f-ing MONTH to get it sorted out ... they just kept shipping new charging units w/o any regard for the fact that their electrician might have screwed something up and the chargers were all fine... anyway, I pray for your sake that they have learned to just send out a qualified electrician to source the problem and that if it's NOT the original installer, it's OK - just GET IT FIXED because it reflects on them as a company as to how they handle their problems.

Ahem.

Dianne

 

[Scott1258]

Here's where we are now: The electrician contractor for Leviton just left. He replaced the charging unit. He checked all the wiring, voltage numbers (with the car charging and with it not charging) , installation correctness and found that my installation was perfect and there were no problems with the power. No problems with the installation job. So, he replaced the unit and told me to let them know if there continues to be a problem. We'll see how it works now. I'll post up and let everyone know if the problem resurfaces or seems to be resolved.

I do have to say that this was pretty great customer service to have an electrician at my house, and a new unit installed, all within about 5 hours of my initial call on a Sunday.

Hey Dianne - thanks for the post! I know you recommended the other charger to us, but due to the miles we are driving I felt going with a 40A charger was the best choice for us since it does charge faster and we only have 6 hours of super off peak time with SCE. The wifey is loving the car. She called me and told me she missed the up high driving position and the size of the RAV as she had to take the Prius today since it did not charge last night. It's great to see you following up on the posts. I was going to be calling you for advice had I not gotten Leviton to help me with this and see if you had any suggestions. It's great knowing you are there should we need anything or can't figure it out by ourselves.

 

[cwerdna]

OP, please stop using the word "charger" when you actually mean EVSE. That Leviton unit you refer to is an EVSE, as is the L1 brick w/J1772 handle that came w/your car.

See diagram at http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=262630#p262630 and ignore the DC quick charge portion (Rav4 EV doesn't have that).

For L1 and L2 AC charging over J1772, the charger is on-board the car.

Perpetuating the wrong terminology can lead to confusion down the road, wasting money or buying the wrong vehicle, equipment or options/equipment level.

 

[Scott1258]

OP, please stop using the word "charger" when you actually mean EVSE. That Leviton unit you refer to is an EVSE, as is the L1 brick w/J1772 handle that came w/your car.

See diagram at http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=262630#p262630 and ignore the DC quick charge portion (Rav4 EV doesn't have that).

For L1 and L2 AC charging over J1772, the charger is on-board the car.

Perpetuating the wrong terminology can lead to confusion down the road, wasting money or buying the wrong vehicle, equipment or options/equipment level.

Hey cwerdna, thanks for the heads up on the correct terminology for the different parts of the car. As a new adopter there is a lot to learn and having this forum to help is an amazing resource. Since we plug in our phones, ipads, laptops etc. to their chargers it just makes you think that anything that a device plugs into to "charge" it is a charger. Not so with the electric cars! It's EVSE for me from now on for my Leviton station that I hope works better tonight. I'll let you know. Thanks for your help.

Scott

 

[cwerdna]

Hey cwerdna, thanks for the heads up on the correct terminology for the different parts of the car. As a new adopter there is a lot to learn and having this forum to help is an amazing resource. Since we plug in our phones, ipads, laptops etc. to their chargers it just makes you think that anything that a device plugs into to "charge" it is a charger. Not so with the electric cars! It's EVSE for me from now on for my Leviton station that I hope works better tonight. I'll let you know. Thanks for your help.

No problem.

See http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=301972#p301972, http://www.myrav4ev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=3517#p3517 and http://sfbayleafs.org/news/2013/01/2013-nissan-leaf-product-highlights/attachment/13leafproduct5/ re: the possible confusion. '11 and '12 Leafs (and current Spark EV) have only a 3.3 kW on-board charger, whereas the '13 Leaf has an optional 6 kW OBC. Rav4 EV has a 10 kW OBC. Focus Electric and Fit EV (and I'm pretty sure the Coda) have always had 6.x kW OBCs, regardless of model year.

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=325438#p325438 is a pretty decent explanation.

As for charger, well, generally wall warts and bricks for iPads, laptops, other rechargeable devices almost always step down the voltage and most convert AC from the wall into DC. L1 and L2 EVSEs do neither and don't alter the line voltage at all. They also have no knowledge of the target battery's state of charge, temperature, chemistry, cell nor pack voltage, condition, etc.

 

[Scott1258]

"It's alive it's alive!"

Yes, my new replaced Leviton EVSE worked last night and the RAV had a full battery this morning. We will see if it continues to perform.

 

[cwerdna]

BTW, https://techinfo.toyota.com/techInfoPortal/staticcontent/en/techinfo/html/prelogin/docs/rav4ev2nd.pdf refers to on-board charger (search for charger as they use the words onboard and on-board), its location and function. This accessible via https://techinfo.toyota.com/public/main/erg.html then Emergency Response & Hybrid Information.

 

[Scott1258]

Leviton replaced the EVSE on Sunday and it charged the car fine on Sunday and Monday nights. However, it did not charge on Tuesday night. Here's a little more info so hopefully someone can give me a direction with this:

I had my electrician install a GE 40a mechanical electric water heater timer before the EVSE so that I can have the EVSE go on during super off peak hours of 12 - 6 am. This way I dont have to worry about the buggy internal RAV4 timer. Seemed like a simple solution.

I spoke with on of the techs from Leviton this morning and he told be that when the timer clicks on the Leviton EVSE has a thing called a Co Load Pickup that causes the unit to have a delay start of anywhere from 2-15 minutes and then it should begin to charge. Seems like it begins to charge sometimes but not other times. It wouldn't work at all this morning, but when I got Victor on the phone it started to work. He is coming to my house tommorrow to take a look at it.

So, anyone know if the Leviton units have problems with being set up with a timer switch? Also, what EVSE's do well with a timer switch? If you have a timer set up with your EVSE and it's working well, please post which model you have.

If I can't get the Leviton to work with my timer another option is to have the power always on and use the RAVCHARGER app. Anyone have the Leviton and ravcharger together with success? Or, I can send the Leviton back to amazon and get a differenct EVSE that works well with my timer switch.

All and any comments, thoughts, and suggestions are highly appreciated! We need to be able to charge the car between 12-6am reliably so that my wife can get to work without worrying if there will be juice in the car. Thanks everyone!

Scott

 

[fooljoe]

If I can't get the Leviton to work with my timer another option is to have the power always on and use the RAVCHARGE app. Anyone have the Leviton and ravcharge together with success? Or, I can send the Leviton back to amazon and get a differenct EVSE that works well with my timer switch.

Naturally, I recommend you go the RavCharge route. If your car/EVSE is capable of starting a charge by using the "Charge Now" button in the entune app, then it will work with RavCharge. This should apply to just about every EVSE out there - the only situation where RavCharge might not work is if your car can't get a cellular signal from wherever it's parked.

This is also a better solution because you might sometimes want to charge outside of the 12am-6am window, or use wall power to pre-warm/cool your car. Also it's been speculated that sometime after charging the car performs a low-power "cell balancing" operation using wall power which might not be good for your battery to skip. Go ahead and give RavCharge a try, you get a free 14 day trial anyway.

 

[Dsinned]

If I can't get the Leviton to work with my timer another option is to have the power always on and use the RAVCHARGE app. Anyone have the Leviton and ravcharge together with success? Or, I can send the Leviton back to amazon and get a differenct EVSE that works well with my timer switch.

Naturally, I recommend you go the RavCharge route. If your car/EVSE is capable of starting a charge by using the "Charge Now" button in the entune app, then it will work with RavCharge. This should apply to just about every EVSE out there - the only situation where RavCharge might not work is if your car can't get a cellular signal from wherever it's parked.

This is also a better solution because you might sometimes want to charge outside of the 12am-6am window, or use wall power to pre-warm/cool your car. Also it's been speculated that sometime after charging the car performs a low-power "cell balancing" operation using wall power which might not be good for your battery to skip. Go ahead and give RavCharge a try, you get a free 14 day trial anyway.

I can attest to the fact that after a (bulk) charge there will be a subsequent automatic, low power (~700W), cell balancing, topping charging of exactly 27 minutes in duration. I don't know the reason why as this is apparently something that Toyota (or more likely Tesla) wants to keep secret. I also don't know how important it is to be done after each charge; presumably it is not important at all to be done EVERY time, or after relatively short duration bulk charging. This is only rather important to know about within the confines of completing any and all charging during off peak rate hours. This is because for longer duration bulk charges (when battery charge depletion is fairly significant), there generally will not be enough time to start a bulk charge after midnight ***AND*** complete a cell balancing charge before 6am. Unless, of course, the charge occurs on a weekend when off peak hours are generally much longer than weekdays. :mrgreen:

 

[fooljoe]

Unless, of course, the charge occurs on a weekend when off peak hours are generally much longer than weekdays.

If OP is under SCE, as I am, then the 12am-6am super-off-peak window applies every day, even on weekends and holidays. And SOP electricity is significantly cheaper than "regular" off-peak.

 

[Scott1258]

Unless, of course, the charge occurs on a weekend when off peak hours are generally much longer than weekdays.

If OP is under SCE, as I am, then the 12am-6am super-off-peak window applies every day, even on weekends and holidays. And SOP electricity is significantly cheaper than "regular" off-peak.

Yes, I'm I. Orange County and have SCE as my provider.

 

[Scott1258]

I had 2 of the software engineers from Leviton at my house this morning checking out the EVSE. Last night, and this morning with them there the unit worked. Of course it did! They ran it through a series of tests and it all checked out according to specs. The best they could tell me was that it may have something to do with the car and that from what they saw the unit is working properly. They suggested I use the RAVs onboard charge timer and see how that works. They both seemed unknowledgeable about the Rav having problems charging with the built in timer.

So, it seems that it not charging at times is intermittent with the mechanical timer attached. These are always tough problems to trouble shoot - if it's not doing it when they are there they can't track it down.

I'm planning on trying ravcharge and using its timer to see what happens. Joe, I've got a question for you: if I set up my mechanical timer to give power to the EVSE at 12am (so that the car does not start charging before super off pear hours begin) and I set ravcharge to start charging the Rav at say 1am - and I set the mechanical timer to cut off power at 6am (again to only be using power during super off peak time) - will these two work together and get the Rav fully charged before the mechanical timer cuts off the Power at 6 am?

I know this probably is a guess on your part, but I would be very interested in what your take is on this setup. I'm determined to make sure I'm only using the juice between 12 - 6am and this seems like a good solution if it works. With ravcharge signaling the car to charge at 1am I would think whatever hiccup it was having before may be bypassed, and the power would start to flow to the car with the car asking for the power from the EVSE at 1am, or whatever time I set it for as ravcharge does its thing. Your thoughts?

I've got about 10 days to send the Leviton EVSE back to Amazon for a refund. If it so much as blinks during the next week or so it's going back. We need an EVSE that is 100% reliable and I'm not sold yet on the Leviton having this expected level of reliability. Any other brands some of you have had that have been rock solid? If I have to replace it I'm thinking about a ClipperCreek - any opinions? Thanks everyone!

 

[fooljoe]

As long as 5 hours is enough to complete a charge with your current setup (I assume it is if you have the 40 amp Leviton and 240V service, except perhaps for a 0-100% extended charge), then RavCharge will work to keep your charging between 12am-6am. Just make sure you set the car's departure timer late enough that it won't start charges early - 9am would probably do.

However, I would recommend you NOT use the mechanical timer, as it seems that it may have caused problems in the past. You're right that I'm mostly just guessing here, but if rebooting the EVSE causes a condition weird enough to keep the car from charging when it's in charge immediately mode then I can't say whether it'll start charging when it gets the charge start command from entune. Just keep the EVSE on at all times and trust in RavCharge to do its thing.

Try it out for a week or so with RavCharge set to something like 12:30 and the EVSE always on and you should be happy with the results.

 

[Scott1258]

Here's a little follow up on the Leviton 40 amp EVSE:: Even after the techs were at my house and they checked it out and gave it a clean bill of health, it still did not charge at times. Even doing a charge now charge it wouldn't charge a couple of times. The problem seemed to be intermitant. Rather than call out the techs again and risk the window of opportunity to return it to amazon I decided to just do a return. Fighting with this thing to get it to be reliable just didn't seem like a good choice. I boxed it up, shipped it back, and got a full refund from amazon. You gotta love amazon!

Leviton did provide excellent customer service to try and make this unit work correctly - but they never solved the problem even with a replacement unit and a visit from their software/technical experts. I need an EVSE that is 100% dependable and reliable every time and the 40 amp Leviton just could not do it for me - YMMV. My wife drives the car to work putting about 75+ miles a a day on the car so we are charging daily. There is no room for error here.

I really want a 40 amp system so we can get all the charge we need in the 6 hour window between 12am and 6am to charge during super off peak hours with SCE. Sometimes we will need to do the extended charge to give her more range and a 30 amp system just takes too long to charge to get it all charged up in that six hour window.

The most viable option for a 40 amp EVSE seemed to be the ClipperCreek CS-60. Yes it's considerably more, but to live with an EV car as a daily driver we need reliability. And from every review I've read on them they are rock solid. I looked at reviews on pretty much every other EVSE being sold and all of them except ClipperCreeks had problems of one kind or another with multiple failures noted. I did consider the multitude of 30 amp units since their price point was much better but all of them had their naysayers and problems noted. I wasn't wiling to take another chance on an EVSE that may or may not work reliably. I couldn't find one negative review or one charging problem noted for any clippercreek EVSE, and they have been building EVSEs in the US for the past 15 years. That said a lot to me. The Leviton was built in Mexico according to the sticker on the box. Their techs told me they have been building this unit for about a year and a half. It appears to me they have some bugs to work out.

So, I ordered the CS-60, had my electrician install it, and it has worked perfectly from day one. It appears to be a much more robust piece of equipment than the Leviton. I'm not an engineer, but all the parts seem to be much more heavy duty, even the handle that goes into the charge port fits more securely. I have signed up for RavCharge and it too has worked flawlessly with my CS-60 and has started the charging sequence at the exact time I have set it to begin charging. My wife is much happier now that she goes out to the Rav in the morning and it's gotten a full charge. With the other problems we were having she was quickly getting disillusioned with the whole EV car idea and was beginning to rapidly look for the return policy. She is now a happier wife and I am having a happier life! Now that all is working she is very much enjoying the car and tells everyone how cool and great it is.

Well, that's my long version of my experience setting up the Rav with a home charging station. But now all is good and Ravcharge is on the job helping too. Clippercreek and Ravcharge is a great combination for me. These two just work - Both are highly recommended!

 

[srl99]

If you applied this logic and pressure to Toyo-sla on the Check EV System now issue you would move more vehicles. More $K in your purse. Some of us don't have time to be beta testers.

We had this problem with Leviton about a year and a half ago, coming at the WORST time because I had so many PHEVs to charge so quickly... and it took a f-ing MONTH to get it sorted out ... they just kept shipping new charging units w/o any regard for the fact that their electrician might have screwed something up and the chargers were all fine... anyway, I pray for your sake that they have learned to just send out a qualified electrician to source the problem and that if it's NOT the original installer, it's OK - just GET IT FIXED because it reflects on them as a company as to how they handle their problems.

Ahem.

Dianne