Charging: Stopped by System Malfunction

[Improve_RAV4EV]

View attachment 1317

On the OBC's Logic connector, where you were testing before, pick one terminal and use it for one of your ohmmeter's leads. For the other lead, backprobe that external jumper (either terminal: they're shorted together). Your ohmmeter should read either 0Ω, 60Ω, or OL.

• If it reads 0 (or under 1, anyway), the lid switch circuit is OK; look at the resistor side of the circuit
• If it reads 60 (or thereabouts), the resistor side of the circuit is OK; look at the lid switch side
• If it reads OL, move your ohmmeter lead on the Logic connector to the other terminal and try again (ie if you were connected to pin 3, try pin 9 now)

Just measured now:
- From OBC X042 Pin #3 to J5 : OL (open circuit, no resistance of 60Ω, something is fishy)
- From OBC X042 Pin #9 to J5 : ~7.1Ω (fluctuating)
- ON OBC X042 across 3 & 9 : OL

I'm taking out the OBC and looking inside (for the 60Ω resistor).
Is OBC repairable, or, should I look for another one? I'd at list give it a try.. Just dunno where to look

 

[alflash]

If there is available access to the charger "brains" board, need inspect it with a magnifying lens and check the resistance of the HVIL resistor line with an ohmmeter: 300 Ohm x 5 (the appearance ща R62 ÷ R66 was shown earlier).
And check their conductivity with the ILKO and ILKI contacts of the D4 connector.

Off-topic.

View attachment 1315

I thought that this has no resistor (it's a jumper only). Do you know?

Sir, please let me know who and where claimed that this board has HVIL resistor(s).
Thanks in advance.
.

 

[Improve_RAV4EV]

If there is available access to the charger "brains" board, need inspect it with a magnifying lens and check the resistance of the HVIL resistor line with an ohmmeter: 300 Ohm x 5 (the appearance ща R62 ÷ R66 was shown earlier).
And check their conductivity with the ILKO and ILKI contacts of the D4 connector.

All resistors show 60Ω. However, R65 (leftmost in the pic) hesitates between 59.9Ω - 60Ω

There's conductivity for both pins #9 & #3 from D4 (X042) to J4 harness as shown in pic.

 

[alflash]

...
And check their conductivity with the ILKO and ILKI contacts of the D4 connector.
...

1. Sir, each of the resistors shown in the photo has a resistance of 300 Ohm.
2. It's a pity that the recommended conductivity check between this "group" resistance and the ILKO(#3) and ILKI(#9) pins of the D4 connector has not been done...
3. Apparently, I'm superfluous in this topic...

 

[Improve_RAV4EV]

resistance of the HVIL resistor line

Now that the OBC out on the table, the resistance between #9 and J5 shows 1.2Ω
#3 and J5 is still OL
#3 and #9 is OL as well.

 

[Improve_RAV4EV]

1. Sir, each of the resistors shown in the photo has a resistance of 300 Ohm.
2. It's a pity that the recommended conductivity check between this "group" resistance and the ILKO(#3) and ILKI(#9) pins of the D4 connector has not been done...
3. Apparently, I'm superfluous in this topic...

It's not you, it's me; I misunderstood (again) your point.

From ILKO(#3) , all the resistors show 60.2Ω (not 300Ω) !

From ILKI(#9) , all resistors show OL

 

[Improve_RAV4EV]

1. Sir, each of the resistors shown in the photo has a resistance of 300 Ohm.

 

[alflash]

It's not you, it's me; I misunderstood (again) your point.

From ILKO(#3) , all the resistors show 60.2Ω (not 300Ω) !

From ILKI(#9) , all resistors show OL

1. Wiring/track on the printed circuit board/metalized hole(s) on the board/contact of the board connector between one side of the "group" resistor and the D4 connector is openю
2. Sir, those five resistors (300 Ohm*) are connected in parallel** and therefore their total resistance is 60 Ohm!

https://alflash.com.ua/2019/to_rav4ev/ching3.jpg

* For example, take a look SMD Resistor Code Calculator
https://www.digikey.com/en/resources/conversion-calculators/conversion-calculator-smd-resistor-code

**

 

[Improve_RAV4EV]

1. Wiring/track on the printed circuit board/metalized hole(s) on the board/contact of the board connector between one side of the "group" resistor and the D4 connector is openю
2. Sir, those five resistors (300 Ohm) are connected in parallel* and therefore their total resistance is 60 Ohm!

Now it makes sense. I must have missed that they were in parallel. I thought each individual resistor should measure 300Ω, which is not possible as soldered.

Since I can read the famous 60Ω from pin #3 to the resistor pack, but not from pin #3 to J5; the circuit must have been broken somewhere, as you said.

I don't see any darkened color components on the board. Could be an internally detached component, a resistor, a diode, or something. The clear protective coat makes checking components very hard.

Beyond this, it exceeds my abilities. I think I better get another OBC.
Any other components that I need to check/worry/replace?

BTW, hokiematt mentioned swapping the MB to eliminate resetting the new Tesla OBC. But, where is the EPROM that the SW flashes located? If it is on the MB, then swapping would not be a good idea?

 

[davewill]

If it's just the HVIL, it should be very repairable, you just have to fix the loop so it's connected through. You don't have to repair the board, just bodge a wire to replace the broken circuit. If you can find someone who can solder a wire, you should be able to repair it. For testing purposes, you might even be able to use a clip lead to bridge the gap.

 

[alflash]

1. I have repeatedly re-flashed donor chargers (video examples on my YouTube channel). But there were cases of problems.
For example, when the donor charger had faulty "brains" (https://alflash.com.ua/2019/to_rav4ev/Story2022-08-13.pdf)

 

[Improve_RAV4EV]

1. I have repeatedly re-flashed donor chargers (video examples on my YouTube channel). But there were cases of problems.
For example, when the donor charger had faulty "brains" (https://alflash.com.ua/2019/to_rav4ev/Story2022-08-13.pdf)

Yeah, that's a risk to take. The seller is usually a junkyard, with no means or knowledge to test the used electronic components. It may very well be another broken OBC (indeed, maybe the reason for junking the car).

 

[Improve_RAV4EV]

If it's just the HVIL, it should be very repairable, you just have to fix the loop so it's connected through. You don't have to repair the board, just bodge a wire to replace the broken circuit. If you can find someone who can solder a wire, you should be able to repair it. For testing purposes, you might even be able to use a clip lead to bridge the gap.

Do you mean that I can run an insulated cable from the resistor pack to one of the J5 legs? That's the only thing I can think of. Otherwise, no visible gap to bridge, unless you know one.
I can solder. But, are you sure I can run a cable directly? I hope that does not blow the OBC up!

There's no visible gap, or a burned circuit line. It may be a component in series, that is broken inside (invisible) and causing an open circuit, who knows?
I'm not an electrician. It's my hobby without a talent. I only have talent in mechanics.

 

[alflash]

If it's just the HVIL, it should be very repairable, you just have to fix the loop so it's connected through. You don't have to repair the board, just bodge a wire to replace the broken circuit. If you can find someone who can solder a wire, you should be able to repair it. For testing purposes, you might even be able to use a clip lead to bridge the gap.

For example
https://alflash.com.ua/2019/to_rav4ev/hvil_sim.jpg

 

[Improve_RAV4EV]

For example

Oh, a resistor, not a paperclip. 60Ω, right?
Do you mean putting it between pins 9 & 3 of D4 (X042) and bypass the J5 (along with the lid magnet) ?

I have 56Ω, 65Ω resistors.

 

[alflash]

Notre. The second photo shows the result of a dishonest use of my advice on how to check HVIL line using a simulator. 62 Ohm resistance was used.

 

[Improve_RAV4EV]

Notre. The second photo shows the result of a dishonest use of my advice on how to check HVIL line using a simulator. 62 Ohm resistance was used.

Which resistor should I use: 56Ω or 66Ω ?
If exact 60 is needed, then I'll try to put together couple resistors to match it.
They are regular resistors, right?

 

[asavage]

Probably too late for where you are in your project, but I'm going to need to refer to this in future, and since I took most of today to get this far . . .



Be careful: the connector views below are of the harness plugs and are looking into the plug, not the back/wires side of the plug, and not the board connector.



To test the Control PCB's 60Ω resistor network, probe the connector pins on the PCB at
J4 bottom row, 2nd from left
J11 bottom row, 4th from right

Ignore the 71Ω reading on the DMM, as the needle adapter probes are trashy Lisle brand and have considerable and variable resistance ; the actual resistance is close to 60Ω.



To test the lid switch, probe the J11 harness connector, and use a small magnet held within a small distance to the side of the reed switch on the AC Input PCB.






More pictures of the Lid Switch are in this post from Mar2023.

 

[alflash]

...
Ignore the 71Ω reading on the DMM, as the needle adapter probes are trashy Lisle brand and have considerable and variable resistance ; the actual View attachment 1331


To test the lid switch, probe the J11 harness connector, and use a small magnet held within a small distance to the side of the reed switch on the AC Input PCB.
View attachment 1332...

Great job!
Nanoquestions
Is it acceptable to measure with a tolerance that shows 71.4 (+19%) instead of 60?
What resistance will your DVOM show if you short-circuit Lisle brand probes?

 

[asavage]

Those Lisle needle probes are lousy: sometimes, 2Ω, sometimes 30Ω. It depends on how you flex them. The variance could be the leads I'm using as well; I grabbed them from a Chinese bench power supply, and they don't inspire confidence either. I don't use them for precise measurements, and I never noticed before just how bad they are, until this project. I need to buy a better set (of both), I guess.

You can see in the first pic that the entire OBC HVIL loop, measured using clip leads and a different set of probes entirely, measured 61.5Ω. That is a Fluke 23 (inexpensive model) that I traded a mini-bar refrigerator for in 1999 and it was well-used even then, and has never been calibrated since, so I'd be surprised if it was within 3% now, and I rarely bother to zero. It's fine for casual checking. I should have grabbed the 79 III instead, but I was lazy.

IOW, while the 71Ω reading is bogus, it can be assumed it's ~60, I think.