Charging halted by malfunction AND Check EV system

[fred_dot_u]

I'm hoping this forum isn't so stale as to be a shot in the dark. I've scoured as much of it as I can manage but have not really found a solution.

My wife's 2013 with a bit fewer than 40,000 miles recently started failing to charge. I discovered that after three or four restarts, it will begin a charge and complete it. Earlier during the troubleshooting, I would power cycle the charger, but believe that's not necessary. The charger works fine on my 2013 with a bit fewer than 40,000 miles.

It's a nuisance, but tolerable, especially since these are in Florida, not exactly the hotbed of Rav4EV service centers.

Yesterday, the Check EV system message appeared, but the vehicle motivates just fine. It was due for a charge and on the third attempt, began and completed. A trip to her work was uneventful as well as the return trip. A side trip in mine to the local VW dealer to find that a purchase is eight months to a year away is fairly disturbing.

I don't have the resources to perform the computer diagnostics described here and there in the forum. Many moons ago, I purchased the OBD adapter, ostensibly to use on a laptop with the Techstuff software, but my comprehension in that regard is near zero.

My current plan is to make an appointment at the local Toyota dealer, hoping the service tech can at least provide codes, to be converted to useful information.

I would appreciate any suggestions for the best approach to this problem. Because the vehicle operates and charges, it's remaining in use, with the understanding that we could be calling roadside service at any time.

I would expect that the ultimate path is a truckin' to California for out-of-warranty repair. The VSA on this vehicle went kaput December last year, unfortunately.

Thanks for listening.

 

[hokiematt]

Your problem is most likely a failing onboard charger (OBC). The is on the Telsa-side of things, so unfortunately your local Toyota dealer will only have the software to check for codes on the Toyota side, which is usually a generic P312F code (that simply means the Tesla gateway has requested the malfunction indicator light ('Check EV Sytems') to come on).

More detailed (and useful) diagnostics require the Tesla powertrain software, which the regional traveling Toyota EV specialist will have; this will require schedule coordination and probably a notable diagnostics fee. An alternative is to arrange with forum member Vlad (@Alflash: https://www.myrav4ev.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=1551) to purchase some inexpensive networking hardware to allow him to remotely diagnose your vehicle with this software.

This recent post elaborates on another user's experience replacing the OBC, as well as working with Vlad for diagnostics: https://www.myrav4ev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=29896

Note that other problems could explain the symptoms you're seeing, such as failing contactors or a loose electrical connection. But historically this has usually been remedied by replacing the OBC.

 

[fred_dot_u]

Thanks for the links. They are immensely helpful. The travails of replacing a charger is likely beyond my physical capacity. I've dropped and replaced the battery packs for two other legacy Rav4EVs (2002, 2003) when I was younger, but after reading the description in the eight pages, I'm confident that I would not be able to manage.

Now we have to decide if we should ship the vehicle to the west coast or bite the big bullet and get on a production list or buy an attractive used EV at a not-so-attractive high-market cost.

You mentioned a traveling EV specialist. Is this someone who makes it all the way to Florida?

 

[alflash]

I'm hoping this forum isn't so stale as to be a shot in the dark. I've scoured as much of it as I can manage but have not really found a solution.

My wife's 2013 with a bit fewer than 40,000 miles recently started failing to charge. I discovered that after three or four restarts, it will begin a charge and complete it. Earlier during the troubleshooting, I would power cycle the charger, but believe that's not necessary. The charger works fine on my 2013 with a bit fewer than 40,000 miles.

It's a nuisance, but tolerable, especially since these are in Florida, not exactly the hotbed of Rav4EV service centers.

Yesterday, the Check EV system message appeared, but the vehicle motivates just fine. It was due for a charge and on the third attempt, began and completed. A trip to her work was uneventful as well as the return trip. A side trip in mine to the local VW dealer to find that a purchase is eight months to a year away is fairly disturbing.

I don't have the resources to perform the computer diagnostics described here and there in the forum. Many moons ago, I purchased the OBD adapter, ostensibly to use on a laptop with the Techstuff software, but my comprehension in that regard is near zero.

My current plan is to make an appointment at the local Toyota dealer, hoping the service tech can at least provide codes, to be converted to useful information.

I would appreciate any suggestions for the best approach to this problem. Because the vehicle operates and charges, it's remaining in use, with the understanding that we could be calling roadside service at any time.

I would expect that the ultimate path is a truckin' to California for out-of-warranty repair. The VSA on this vehicle went kaput December last year, unfortunately.

Thanks for listening.

Please do it first
1. Clear message Check EB system
Method 1. As shown in
https://youtu.be/TaN7g-7cxBM
Method 2. Disconnect for 5 minutes with the ignition on, the negative terminal of the 12V battery.

2. Believe me, does this message appear in the Charging mode?
If charging does not work, what is the behavior of these indicators https://youtu.be/t29AjsbwXgo

3. Did you write "I would like to know if it is necessary (as expected) to replace the OBC", OBC this is OnBoardCharger?

1/2 OFF/ Video about Sport Mode
https://youtu.be/9dHay6vqqvs

 

[alflash]

p.s.
Note.
Connecting remote diagnostics (for reading codes, checking parameters, etc.) is only useful when a malfunction shows itself. If everything is OK during the diagnosis, for example, when the battery charging is working well and correctly, we will NOT be able to find out * why it did not work earlier.
Question. Can you recreate the failure conditions during diagnostics?

* Tesla systems in RAV4EV don't store trouble codes after the ignition is turned off

 

[fred_dot_u]

I'm not sure where the sport mode is involved in this, especially as it has never been selected during the entire ownership. I am a hypermiler and my wife, although heavier on the pedal than I, does not desire the performance boost.

So far, the charging failure has been consistent. It sometimes takes three or four plug-in/plug-out sequences to get the charging to begin. Yesterday's charge was one in/out and the second insertion was a successful start to the charge.

 

[alflash]

Note.
The presence / absence of inclusion of the Sport mode is not a question for determining the cause of a charging malfunction. This is a question for a general assessment of the condition of the vehicle

 

[fred_dot_u]

We test drove a Volkswagen ID.4 a couple of days ago. The sales person has to drive it from the lot to a public road and he has a heavy foot. The vehicle was in sport mode and pushed us into the seats, although only momentarily. I mentioned our low-acceleration preference, which meant he did not display the performance of this EV, which I understand is quite impressive.

My car is on the charger at the moment, after driving 120 miles with 24 miles reserve on the GOM. When we first bought this vehicle I had a 146 mile trip with 25 miles reserve, which is amazing in retrospect. I've seen references that this vehicle is EPA rated for a bit more than 100 miles.

No highway driving for me and I'm very light on the pedal. My wife is now experiencing the warning for many days and has discovered that she is improving her consumption figured. Previously, it was 3.0 to 3.5 Wh per mile and is now running 4.0 and above. Perhaps we will be able to repair this problem and she can continue to manage economical driving.

Even though we are in Florida and it is just as hot as much of the planet, we rarely use the air conditioning/climate control, giving us these great values for economy.

 

[alflash]

... Previously, it was 3.0 to 3.5 Wh per mile and is now running 4.0 and above. Perhaps we will be able to repair this problem and she can continue to manage economical driving.

May be kWh
It is generally accepted that the consumption of this auto is 3.5 miles per 1 kWh.
Check data in Trip Information menu of display.

Note, We can check HV battery SOH of your RAV4E. By Tony Test or Tesla diagnostic software

 

[fred_dot_u]

Yes, that's correct. I'm not sure where my alleged mind was floating at the time. I had a running Gizmo EV in which I installed a Cycle Analyst. That display was Wh per mile and I grew accustomed to that reference, even though I recognize the figures for miles per kWh.

With respect to the Sport Mode reference. She moved the car about the parking lot and attempted to switch to Sport Mode. The display presented a message that it was unable to enter that mode.

She will make the attempt again on her return home, but I do not expect to see any change. We shall see.

 

[jfletter]

Yes, that's correct. I'm not sure where my alleged mind was floating at the time. I had a running Gizmo EV in which I installed a Cycle Analyst. That display was Wh per mile and I grew accustomed to that reference, even though I recognize the figures for miles per kWh.

With respect to the Sport Mode reference. She moved the car about the parking lot and attempted to switch to Sport Mode. The display presented a message that it was unable to enter that mode.

She will make the attempt again on her return home, but I do not expect to see any change. We shall see.

Your current situation sounds eerily like mine during the early days of my failing OBC. The writeup that HokieMatt shared and I believe you read briefly explained that starting symptoms. One plug in would charge the car a few mile, another some more/less miles and another fully charge it. But after a while, I think a month, it stopped charging entirely. I'm going to guess that you will end up in the same boat as me with a failed charger. It will be removed and there will be one or two blown fuses. Hopefully just replacing the fuses will fix the problem. I am luck because I had alflash and Davio's brains and brawn to get my repair done without shelling out $5,000 or more to Toyota. I don't think anyone here knows how to diagnose and fix more than the fuses in a Tesla gen 1 OBC. I would love to diagnose my failed OBC but I am unwilling to take my car apart more than I already did to diagnose the real problem now that my car is working perfectly again.

Trust alflash. While he can't fix your car for you from Ukraine, he can help diagnosing and cycle the EV system before and after any repair.

I am curious, where in Florida do you live? I will be in Miami at the end of October. If it is not too far from there then I might be able to help you if you need it. You can private message me here to exchange personal information if that is of interest to you.

 

[fred_dot_u]

I've been exchanging emails with Vladimir and providing the necessary screen shots and data to him. The current status is that remote diagnostics will be necessary, which was more or less expected.

The larger problem is that my physical state is such that I won't be able wrench on the car, regardless of the diagnostic results. I don't have a Waldo with sufficient capability to dismantle the vehicle for repair purposes. Realistically, I don't have any Waldo.

I'm hopeful that once the true status is known, I can find a mechanic with some experience who is able to take on a contract to repair the vehicle. I've read the travails of dealer related service and know that it is something to avoid!

Florida is such a huge state. I'm mid-way East Coast, five to six hours from Miami. I appreciate the offer to assist, but considering that I can't do anything, it's not so much an assist as it is a complete task.

Our previous Rav4EVs were legacy models, a 2002 and a 2003 and I was healthier and had dropped and replaced the battery packs multiple times. Selling one of them was really selling only the motor and power train and the recipient required that I remove it, crate and ship it. That was the last physical task I could accomplish and gravity was on my side.

I'm surprised to consider that a fuse can cause this type of problem and I'm hoping that is the case for my wife's vehicle. Far less expensive than a new/used OBC, but no less labor intensive.

Is it practical to consider to create an "above-ground" test bed if the fuses are replaced? I saw the photos showing the coolant routing through the OBC and all the wiring. It makes sense to be able to test it before buttoning things up. Not creating the test bed would mean that if it is the fuses, the extra work of making a test fixture could be avoided.

The good part of all this is that after two to four plug-in/plug-out cycles, the car charges fully and "normally." I know it's foolish to think this will last forever.

My wife's brain is in the "buy a VW ID.4" mode! I don't want to throw away what could become a fully working Rav4EV.

 

[alflash]

A small part of the diagnostic results

Tomorrow after Confirmation Driving Pattern remote diagnostics will continue with additional checks.

 

[fred_dot_u]

The trip to and from work of my wife's car was unremarkable. No error messages appeared.

As per our earlier discussions and with some additional conversations with David, I connected the L1 charging device when the vehicle returned to the house. As usual, the charging made the expected sounds and also as expected, ended after about 30 seconds, with the dash panel message of termination.

The L2 charger connected and began to charge in the normal manner, well beyond the 30 seconds.

This is typical, as I am able to get the charging to start after any number of plug-out/plug-in actions. The highest number has been charging on the 4th sequence, the lowest has been an instant good beginning and all numbers in between.

There is great happiness in the household to feel comfortable with the Check EV System message no longer appearing.